Stop Chasing Work-Life Balance | #REalAdvice 28 With Edwin Eshaghian

Are you chasing work-life balance? 

Or have you made peace with knowing that there is really no such thing, especially in the real estate industry?

Anyone who has joined the real estate industry knows the potential of limitless income. They’ve also quickly learned just what kind of drive and passion it takes to grasp at that income. You can’t expect to have “work-life balance” and an incredible career at the same time.

Instead of trying to achieve that mythical work-life balance, what would happen if, instead, you chased work-life integration?

You set the boundaries; you decide when you’ll work. You protect the free time to pursue hobbies and activities you enjoy and are passionate about - some of the things that you got you passionate about leaving your 9-5 in the first place!

What changes would you experience if you called the shots; you set up boundaries around your personal life. If you created - and enforced - boundaries about when you would and wouldn’t work?

My team has learned that on Sundays, unless something is on fire, you can’t reach me! I work hard, creating content and trainings that serve others. But at the same time, I set up protection for my family life: it’s important to me!

In this episode of the #REalAdvice podcast, Edwin Eshaghian and I sit down and talk about the myth of work-life balance, and what you can do to set yourself up for success with work-life integration. 


Guest Introduction:

This episode’s guest on the #REalAdvice podcast is Edwin Eshaghian, regional manager at Cornerstone Mortgage Group. Edwin is passionate about setting goals and expectations to posture for long-term success in an industry plagued with burnout.

Highlights of this episode: 

  • Jonathan introduces Edwin Eshaghian and his business.

  • Jonathan and Edwin talk about work-life balance and what that actually means.

  • “I don’t have work-life balance … don’t expect to have work-life balance and an incredible career at the same time.” ~ Edwin

  • Work-life integration is key: make specific times that you work, and enforce times when you don’t work!

  • The real estate field doesn’t always stay within 9-5 hours. It’s up to YOU to create that work-life integration.

  • Set expectations from the beginning: you help people know how to work with you.

  • Use your email signature/out of office message to help with setting those expectations.

  • Do you say that you’re a 24 hour worker? If you’re not actually working 24 hours, then stop lying to your clients! Set reasonable expectations with yourself and your clients.

  • People appreciate the transparency of set expectations and will give space for the “I don’t know’s” that will eventually happen in business.

  • It takes time to build a culture of transparency and trust: keep your business ‘client first’ and build from there.

  • Be comfortable with saying “I don’t know, but I’ll find out” and set expectations of clients that allows you to be able to say that!

  • What makes you and your business unique and special? Be like Domino’s Pizza and lean into that!

  • Jonathan and Edwin talk about soci al media, gratitude, and storytelling. 

  • Edwin’s last piece of advice: don’t take people in your life for granted. Don’t forget, success and money cannot buy relationships.

Special shout out to Edwin Eshaghian for being this episode’s guest for #REalAdvice! You can connect with him here:


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Audio Version Below!

Full Transcript

Edwin: 00:00 Everybody feels like they're the best. Everybody feels like nobody works harder than me and I think looking in the mirror, this is what I did early in my career too. I'm like, I'm the best, I know everything because I was 20 years old when I started and you just want to be the best because you see the best person guy or gal living a certain type of way and you're like, Oh, I want to be that. So I'm just going to say I'm that. And then as you make those mistakes, as you try to find your balance, as you miss an email or two, as you watch game of Thrones one Sunday and you miss a text, you realize that, Hey, I either got to be this person or this person or somebody in the middle, but you got to know who you are first and where you, where your own expectations are. If you want to go on your wedding anniversary and you want to be with your wife or your husband or whatever your you're doing, set that expectation and be transparent about it. I think people appreciate the transparency

Jonathan: 00:48 today. We are with Edwin Eshaghian, a teller turned banker who opened up his own call center and now he's taken that experience and infused it into his current position as regional manager of cornerstone mortgage group, an industry plagued with burnout. I don't believe in the terms work life balance because I think that if you have to balance one or the other, that means that you're trying to essentially say, Hey, I'm going on vacation this weekend so I can get rid of work or not focus on work. So absolutely what I like to say is work life integration where you integrate your life into your work, you integrate your work into your life and they work together. Not a, Oh dang it. I can't check emails just because you know, I hate work and I've already left the office. So like I just want to check out. What are your thoughts on work life integration as opposed to work life balance?

Edwin: 01:42 Yes, great question. Um, I think in, in our field real estate mortgages, it's good to create a lifestyle work. So what you're saying, where you integrate the two because the consumer, the client that we're serving, they're not going to be available from nine to five usually they're working from nine to five. So you kinda gotta integrate to to where you're like, okay, I still want to have a family. I still want to have a life. I still want to do the things that make me me, but my career also makes me who I am. It also provides for my family. It also lets me serve the community. So there's ways of doing both and integrating the two and sometimes we just have to realize that you might get a nine out of 10 in work and a five out of 10 in your personal life and then the next day you might get a 10 out of 10 in your personal life and a five out of 10 and work.

Edwin: 02:28 It doesn't mean you're failing at either, but it's hard to separate the two. If you want to be a great family person and you want to be great at business, that's going to take a great person that knows how to juggle both. And it might be a 10, 12 hour day to love what you do and love your family. And I think going into what the right mindset where, Hey, there's no such thing a Gary V laughs about it, the passive income, there's no magic way. You're unicorn to just have a great career and have a great life. You've got to build it in steps. And I think with the younger generation, um, if they start to realize it's

Jonathan: 03:00 okay for it to take a few years to get there and you're not going to have the dream vacation and the dream house all at once, you're gonna work for both at the same time. I think the word integration is the way, I think the reason that the work life balance kind of debate is out there is because a lot of people hate the fact that their clients will call them at 9:00 PM right? A lot of real estate agents don't like the fact that if they're on vacation, they're getting a lot of emails. I think it's actually the real estate agents fault because what I see, at least what I see, and I think a lot of people would agree with me, a lot of agents go out there and they say three 65 24 seven hustle grind. Like if you need anything you call me day or night, I'm going to work hard for you.

Jonathan: 03:49 Nobody can outwork me. Right? So the moment that somebody does take you up on that and calls you at 9:00 PM and you don't answer your phone, then you shouldn't blame anyone other than yourself. Why? Because you set the expectations wrong from the beginning. For me, when I was a real estate broker, everybody knew Sunday family days, Jonathan is going to be very hard to reach unless it's an emergency. Absolutely right. Jonathan for the most part is not going to answer emails after 6:00 PM why? Because he showed us on his phone that the app just turns off where he can't even get notifications. And he's also told us where if there's an emergency, just call me and we know that we can get a, you know, we can get in touch with him. So I think that setting the expectations up from the front are huge.

Jonathan: 04:36 Um, another pet peeve of mine, and I don't know why I'm talking about pet peas, but let's talk about it is when you're doing an email signature and you are going on your wedding anniversary, okay. Rather than just setting your email signature to say, Hey, I'm out of the office for a few days, you know, but you can talk to my assistant. Just go out there and say, Hey, I'm on my wedding anniversary. Thank you for allowing me to enjoy time with my wife. Right. Thank you for allowing me to go on vacation with my family. I know, you know, you know, that family's so important to me, so I definitely appreciate that. What are your thoughts or what piece of advice would you give to some agents that are setting the expectations wrong? And maybe you've might've done this in your own career where you've learned a lesson or two, it just, yeah, it just comes down to, I think the first thing is setting expectations with yourself. That I think more times out of, more times than not, people think I'm working so hard. I'm the hardest worker. I'm the 24 hour a day worker like you're talking about. But in reality, internally, that's not where they're at and that's not who they are. And so they're kind of lying to themselves to start with, and then that translates to lying to the people they're working to serve. So I think you've got to set expectations with yourself. I think there are some agents, lenders, professionals that

Edwin: 05:58 do work nine 10 that will answer those emails. And if that's where you're at in your life and that's good and that works for you, then put that out there. And then if you're not that person, then you should also have a different alignment as far as your own expectations that that person will perform probably at a higher level maybe or maybe not depending on their nerves. They're stressed, their, their ability to perform their craft. But I think that's the first thing. I think when I talk to a lot of loan officers, realtors, everybody feels like they're the best. Everybody feels like nobody works harder than me. And I think looking in the mirror, this is what I did early in my career too. I'm like, I'm the best I know everything cause I was 20 years old when I started. And you just want to be the best because you see the best person guy or gal living a certain type of way and you're like, Oh I want to be that.

Edwin: 06:42 So I'm just going to say I'm that. And then as you make those mistakes, as you try to find your balance, as you miss an email or two, as you watch game of Thrones one Sunday and you miss a text, you realize that, Hey, I either got to be this person or this person or somebody in the middle, but you got to know who you are first and where, where your own expectations are. If you want to go on your wedding anniversary and you want to be with your wife or your husband or whatever you're, you're doing, set that expectation and be transparent about it. I think people appreciate the transparency. If you want to be this person that says, Hey, I'm going to do anything all the time, still go on your wedding anniversary anniversary, but then say, honey, I got to take this color too.

Edwin: 07:19 So again, it's setting your own expectations with you, your loved ones, the people that are intertwined with you, and then extending that out to whoever you're working with in any profession. So today we're with Edwin ASOG. Ian, you got it. And we'd kind of just jump directly into the episode, but let's backtrack a little bit. Tell us a little bit about yourself. Tell us about some of the things you believe in, some of the things you liked, some of the things you don't like. Who is Edwin? Uh, still trying to figure that out now. Um, so I'm a mortgage lender. That's cool. I need one of those for my phone calls. But, uh, so I'm a mortgage lender. I'm the phone call. One was

Speaker 3: 07:57 top, top

Edwin: 07:59 dominoes pizza. Okay, let's go back. So I'm, I'm a mortgage lender. I've been doing loans for 10 years. Uh, started off in retail, working at the banks, kind of slithered my way up from being a teller banker to being a loan officer. Then I worked in the call center world for five, four years. And then recently about two and a half years ago, I blended what I learned from the call center, the banks to what we do now, which is a hybrid of being able to take the best from the call center, which is the phone service, answering emails, technology to make the client experience better, but also making it personable. Where, where human beings, you could see us shake our hands, but a face to the name. Um, so that's in a nutshell who I am. Workwise FamilyWise family's huge to me. Like I've always told you, having honor is the key word.

Edwin: 08:42 If you're going to say, what's one word that describes me, I think honors the word. I think people should never trade who they are. Whatever that is, you know, for anything. Money, fame, a love relationship and be true to yourself. It's kind of what we were just talking about. So I think if you're saying who's Edwin? He's a hard worker. He loves his family, loves his friends. And, um, I believe in honor and, uh, that's the number one thing and kinda everything stems from that, you know, having an honor and meaning what you say, doing what you doing, what you say and um, just being true to yourself. W if somebody were to call you and reach out for the first time business related and they said, uh, what makes you different than any of the other lenders in the area? What would your answer be to them?

Edwin: 09:28 Ironically that I, that I do work 24 hours a day. So, so I would say that's number one. Um, experience. We've, as a team, we've closed a substantial amount of business. Um, our rates are phenomenal. We always focus on rates. I'm always in a pursuit of how can I deliver a good rate. Like I've, I've told you offline as well. Um, people should have the right to find the best rate. It does impact their scenario. I think technology over the next few years will, will shed light to the mortgage world more and more. Where uh, there's a, a notion that you should get a higher rate because a certain loan scenarios are more difficult or more convoluted. Uh, you're smiling because there's a lot, there's, there is some truth to that. So I don't want to knock on my own profession. My dad was a lender for 20 plus years too.

Edwin: 10:14 I know there's loan scenarios that a newer loan officer couldn't do, but I also know that as the years have gone on, technology has allowed them to be able to do it while delivering a great rate to the consumer, which is very important because it changes buying a $400,000 house or getting a $450,000 house, same payment. So, um, and if I was talking to somebody for the first time, I say, I will deliver you the best scenario transparently. There are some scenarios where not the best thing. So at the end, those cases, I'll give you two or three suggestions of other lenders that I have reputation that I know that they'll do a good job and I'll say, go work with them because that's gonna fit your need better. And so that's kind of what has blessed our business and we were highly referral based because we're not about one or two transactions where admittedly earlier on my career, when I don't have any money, when I'm under stress, you don't have that luxury.

Edwin: 11:05 So it takes time to build that kind of culture. So I'm not blaming anybody for how they do business. I'm just talking about how we do business. It's always client first. Everything else kind of falls into place from there. A lot of people to like to talk about their wins and they locked like to talk about their records and they liked to talk about the things that their business has done for them. But rather than talking about that, what would you say would be one of the biggest mistakes that you've made in building your business, in building your reputation and just any mistakes that you've made in the past? I think you said 10 years in the mortgage industry. Um, there's a lot of them. Uh, so I think biggest mistake patients would be one. Uh, again, expectations, being realistic with myself now looking at the person who left a right because you could start in this business at the same time as some other people, but they might have family connections in a certain market.

Edwin: 12:02 They might have language abilities, they might look a certain way, they might talk a certain way, they might have certain things that you don't, but if you both work hard, it's kinda like the Colby Brian, work ethic to me, if you just work hard and focus on yourself and your patient, it will come together in the manner in which it should. Sorry, I should've put this on. Do not disturb another mistake. Put your phone on. Do not disturb unless you tell your clients that you answer your phone 24, seven, except during the real advice podcast. Give me 30 minutes. Um, so I think being patient would be a huge one. Setting correct expectations. Um, becoming more comfortable early on, telling somebody I don't know, but I'll find out. I wish I knew that nine years ago before I had those heart attacks and stressful nights. Cause you just want to say yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.

Edwin: 12:51 And would you, would you recommend that also to not only just people in the mortgage industry, real estate industry, or just any industry? I guess I would recommend that a thousand times more than I would recommend the nine years ago because of Google, because you're able to Google certain things and there's as much good information as bad, but then it all gets convoluted. So people are going to search for the right answers. Most people know 10 lone people, multiple note, 10 dentists. Yelp will show you 20 in an area. Most people have options because of the internet. So when you're not saying the right thing or you're giving incorrect answers, you're gonna get caught more times out of more times than not. So just avoid it because no one's ever going to be mad at somebody usually for saying, I don't know. Unless again, going back to what you put out there, you're claiming that you're the best and you know everything, then you can't do that.

Edwin: 13:38 So it comes down to everything comes down to what are you putting out there? How are you portraying yourself? What's the expectation you're putting? If I'm saying I'm a humble person, I've been doing loans for 10 years, we do a pretty good job. I'm not positioning myself as the King of loans so I can once in a while say, I don't know, but I'll find out for you and this is the timeline and I'll instead of, if it takes two hours, I might say three and a half to give myself a little bit of time cause things happen so that on that three-and-a-half Mark, Hey mr client or mrs client, I told you, I don't know, but I told you I was gonna find the answer. Here's the answer. Let me send you an email with the guideline, the snippet, whatever it is that fits exactly what you asked so that you know that this is concrete.

Edwin: 14:18 A lot of people have, how should I say this? A lot of people have things that they would want to tell people. Like, for instance, there's a lot of things that I see agents doing good or bad where I, I will go out there and say, you know, as a whole, a lot of agents are doing this incorrectly and this is what I want to tell you guys. Or as a whole, this is what's working. You guys should be doing this. Is there anything that you feel is something that you want agents to hear? Um, maybe it's something that they're doing incorrectly that you would recommend

Jonathan: 14:52 they do something a different way or maybe there's just something that you've been itching to tell people to the masses and you can, you can always say no as well.

Speaker 4: 15:03 Um,

Jonathan: 15:05 I think it just comes down to just have a little bit of humility and whatever you do, no matter how good you are, you know, if you're Michael Jordan, you retire 20 years later that we still know you're Michael Jordan. So you've mentioned a few people, you've mentioned Coby, you've mentioned Michael Jordan, you said Domino's earlier, which is kind of funny. Do you know the story behind Domino's pizza? I just know $5 gets me a good pizza. So it's actually, that's kind of funny because a quick story is that the two brothers of Domino's, when they started, they purchased a company called Dominick's for $900 the one brother agreed that they were purchasing this so that way they can pay for college. That's what they were doing it. So one brother worked during the day. The other one would go to school at night. The other one would work during the night.

Jonathan: 15:53 The other brother would go to school during the day. [inaudible] really cool. It actually did not work out well for them and one of the brothers decided that, Hey, I just want to sell you back to your share. You can do the pizza company. I'm going to focus on this, and it actually comes back to what my main thing is. So I go over five different topics. My first one is you have to develop your main concept. Domino's pizza drastically overnight. Went from a one brother leaving them because this didn't work to this is now Domino's as we see it today because they came out with a slogan that says pizza delivered in 30 minutes or less guaranteed and that catapulted them into $1 billion company because they had a main concept. I think that a lot of people, when they get a question posed to them on what makes you different, they have a lot of different answers.

Jonathan: 16:47 Or they tell somebody this and then say this. I think that it's very keen to uh, make sure that you understand your main concept. For me, that's, I help entrepreneurs launch and scale a business and life they love, right? For other companies, they have all these different things. But outside of the domino story, you mentioned a few different people and one of the questions that I'd like to ask people sometimes is, and it's good that I ask it on the spot because if not, you'd go and prepare for the question. If there were three people that you can meet today for lunch, dead or alive, who would those people be? And why not to get overly religious. But I do have a faith. I'm a man of faith, so I'm biblically speaking, King David is really somebody close to them, to my heart because he was a serial sinner per se in the Bible, but he became one of the greatest Kings for his, even though he had

Edwin: 17:50 a lot of flaws because his heart was after the Lord. So I would want to talk to him and say like, you had such a close relationship with God, you still did all these things wrong, but then you still had a heart for the Lord. I would just try to kind of understand his, his thought process. Cause you went from nobody to a King. Again, according to the Bible, God was with him throughout the w the way. But you made a lot of human errors too. And uh, just kind of understand what made this person hit. Even historically, history writes about them a lot of great things. I would want to get to know him for sure. Um, I would want to Hmm. To more dessert. These are good. I'm trying to think who else. I'd want to meet. Uh, I would want to be Michael Jordan for sure.

Edwin: 18:36 Cause I, I, I love people that were not afraid to fail. I love people that, why I like Michael Jordan is, I always think of him, Tom out looking you in the eyes, I'm going to score on you. Like that's it. You know when the games like you see him, like it's just so Epic. It's so electric and there's been a lot of other great basketball players. But there was something special about him cause he was constantly told no in his own way. You know, you missed the shot. Wasn't the number one guy in college. Just had to get his way onto the team. Um, dad passed away, fever, championship, championship, championship, championship shot. I'm going to go play baseball, come back and do it again. Granted, there's a lot of good teammates. It's just um, in fact you waited with the person's mind that there's other great athletes, huge bodies, good shape, talented.

Edwin: 19:29 But this guy would just execute. And so that's so fascinating to me as a business person. Not because of the rings or the championship, but in the ability to just execute, focus, execute. So in alone, it's timelines, client's dreams, emotions. There's an agent on each side, there's a person, single married family. There's a vision into, I want to get the keys to this house because I'm here and I see myself here for five 10 1520 years. And all of that's riding on this person called the loan officer that has to execute a certain timelines in a proper way and sometimes they don't, which causes emotional distress. So for me, it's like be a Michael Jordan and your business were the same way when he's on the court and you're watching all over the world, you know that when he's on the court and the balls in his hand, he's going to score.

Edwin: 20:16 So I love, love Michael Jordan. I talk about Colby because he imitated a lot of stuff that Jordan did, but through work ethic he was able to almost perfect it. And obviously he has his own style and I'm from Los Angeles right now, so I'm a Lakers guy, you know. So it was Coby your third person or no different than Jordan would kind of get that out of my system. Okay. No disrespect to Colby. Um, we're going to tag him in that. I would like to meet him too. I've actually met him. I was like a fan, you know. Um, he obviously doesn't remember me, but um, Jordan would be for sure. Third one. Uh, no real specific reason. I never met my, I never met my mom's dad, so I'll just want to meet him to kind of know all my heritage, get to know my other grandfather, uh, just to kind of piece it all together and keep that going for the future generation.

Edwin: 21:08 Like, Hey, my dad's dad, this grandpa was like this, there's grandpa was like that. And my mom was like this. My dad was like that. I was blessed to have a family. We moved country to country. We, I wasn't born here. Um, so that's like the missing link in my family that I, that I obviously know my mom, but I don't, I don't know her dad. So just kind of meet him and as immigrants, as I'm an Armenian descendant, I'm Armenian, obviously. Um, just kinda know my family because there's a lot of history from early 19 hundreds with what we went through to, to now and just meet the other one and uh, piece it all together and then pass it to the next generation. I love, I love asking that question because it, it really tells a lot about who the person is. It tells them a lot about what they're thinking.

Edwin: 21:52 It tells a lot about what they do believe in, what they don't believe in and it just really gets you to, to talk and really think about it, especially on the spot. It gets you to think like, Oh man, like, Whoa, Whoa, who would this be? Who would that be like, what? And when you answer the questions and people are listening, they, they'll truly understand a little bit more about you. I know I did in, one of the things that I got out of that right at the end was I wasn't born in this country. And I think a lot of people, not in just in real estate, but a lot of people like to use excuses of why things don't work out for them. Right. I'm not saying that you came out there in, uh, you know, instantly overnight where this huge success, but what are some of the obstacles or hurdles, you know, not being born in this country that if somebody else is listening to this, you know, and they're kind of, they're not fulfilling their true self because they're using that excuse of, Oh, I wasn't born in this country. I don't have the same opportunities. What would you say to somebody out there, um, from a, Hey, not, not from the, I can do it you, so you can do it standpoint, but from the standpoint of, you know, this is what I would recommend to you, or this is a piece of advice that I would give to you.

Edwin: 23:08 I would just say, think about how you got here, your parents or somebody that for whatever reason, thought that you would be better off being in this country and they had to go through certain steps, whatever that may be. I know it's a big conversation right now with immigration and whatnot, but not to get political, whatever they had to do in whatever scenario. I'm not saying what's right or wrong in your own personal life. Somebody's in their intentions were good to bring you here because there's a lot of things that people take for granted that this country has given to so many of us. Everybody here, right? Um, that there's soldiers that die for, there's people that work hard. There's first responders, there's everybody taxes. We're all paying taxes. We all contribute to this thing that makes it a country, right? So I would ask them, I would say, have you thought about how you ended up here?

Edwin: 24:01 I'm not saying it's perfect because growing up we were again, very blessed that we had good times, bad times as part of it. Everybody does. Um, some of the challenges are, no one's really done it before in this place. So my dad did certain things and I'll won't make some of those decisions good or bad because I've seen it one time. My child will be one step ahead of me. My nephew will be one step ahead of my brother and I, you know what I mean? Which is fine. That's, that's how it should be. But I would just say think, just think about how you got here and be grateful because if you really, really knew who or why they brought you here, you might look at things differently regardless of today, which is difficult because I know it's cheesy and we're on social media doing this, but social media really, really makes it hard for people to be grateful sometimes.

Edwin: 24:50 Cause you're inundated, you know? So I tell people you should have an intimacy with your vision, with your life, the people in your life and what do you want to be in your life? And if you have a romance with where you want to end up, you won't be scrolling and looking at whatever everyone else is doing. You'll just be in love. And then that'll turn into passion. Sometimes you're happy, sometimes the passion can be too passionate, you know, but, but you'll let that passion kind of ignite and just be in love with whatever you're doing and understand that love in a relationship and a business and anything has compromised and challenges. Um, so know what you love and why. And once you find that, just let it flow and just do it. Sometimes we wrap these things up, but then some of our guests has said, Hey, I wish you would have asked me this, or I wish you would've said this or I had this question for you now.

Edwin: 25:40 Um, and so I'm gonna pose that to you. Is there anything that you're itching to talk about or is there anything you would want me to ask you? Or on the flip side, is there anything that you would like to ask me? Yeah, I would like to ask you a question. Um, you obviously did a great job. We met each other at the Tom ferry, which I was like blown away when we had that mastermind. And uh, I'm glad we stayed friends since then. I would ask you, because I'm obviously I work with loan officers, building, cultivating, coaching them. You do this similar thing with real estate agents. I would ask you what's the hardest objection to overcome or how do you overcome the objection or how do you pose the value of using social media? Because it's such a great thing when used correctly to connect to your clients. So if you were to just elevator pitch and just tell somebody, why should I use social

Jonathan: 26:44 media, why should I not push it back and why should I just give it a chance? Even though you're super successful in your business, this is just another tool that's going to become more and more of the television of tomorrow. Um, I guess that's maybe the elevator pitch right there, but what in your words, um, because you've really taken this and ran with it and I, I love what you do. What would you say to somebody that says, Hey, you know what, John, I don't want to use social media. I'm good. So first off, I would tell them if something else is working for them, let's use cold calling. For example. If they come to me and they say, Hey Jonathan, we don't want to do this because cold calling works so well for us. Um, you know, we don't want to do this. I would tell them, great.

Jonathan: 27:21 I would answer the exact same way as you. However, I would put this social media on what we call our idea or project board, meaning we're doing something that works really well for us, so we're not going to give that up. However, we are going to take the time to learn and to innovate and to grow. So that would be on that list. And the reason that I would tell you to make sure that social media is on your list is because I talk from the standpoint of the brain and I talk from the standpoint of this is how human behavior works. Why? Because I was an army intelligence officer who understands how human behavior works. When I'm telling somebody facts, when I'm sending them a postcard, when I'm door knocking, when I'm doing anything and talking fact-based, I'm only using two portions of somebody else's brain.

Jonathan: 28:10 Okay? Meaning I'm telling you this, I was the greatest listing agent, blah, blah, blah. Two portions. When I tell them a story and when I show them a story, I am now triggering triggering, excuse me, five portions of their brain and the reason that is so important and the opportunity that people have in front of them through social media is they can tell stories and I believe a great story has a beginning, a middle and an end. They don't need to give the entire story all at once. Social media is the closest thing as opposed to being directly in front of somebody that you can get to tell a story on somebody else's own time on demand 24 seven 365 days a year. You can have a library of your stories. And what happens is when you tell a captivating story, the, the most intriguing part of that is the other person is actually envisioning themselves as a part of the story.

Jonathan: 29:03 Where do I play? How does this affect me? And the moment that you can get your marketing message into their subconscious is the moment that they take action. So I'm not saying that there's other things that you should drop. I'm not saying that there's other things that you shouldn't do, but if you're hesitant on social media, then you really need to pay attention what's going on. Because if not, and what is currently happening is the disruptors will tell the story of how bad you are of how much you don't work, of why you should use them over you. Correct, right or wrong. They're doing is storytelling through social. And it's captivating the audience where they think, well, maybe I don't need a real estate agent. I can just do this on my own. Well, maybe I should do this. And so if you're not in the social game, then you're only hurting yourself.

Jonathan: 29:56 And the industry as a whole because you do have a story to tell, right, wrong, good, bad, ugly. Doesn't matter. Your story is not going to be perfect. That's what resonates with people. Social media gives you that ability. Reality TV is so captivating. Why? Cause people envisioned one of two things. This is, this is amazing. I wish I could be just like that person or this is not how it actually works. It actually, we actually do this. We actually do that. There's no, there's no gray area in the middle. Nobody just watches reality TV just because it was on. They, they, they start watching it and they're so ingrained and in and just captivated in the moment cause they're on one end of the spectrum. They're mad because that's not really what we do or I wish I could be just like that person and social media can do the exact same thing for you.

Jonathan: 30:46 It can grow your business. I know that it can grow your business because over 50% of my business was through social media and it wasn't through social media like, Hey, you know, I'm the best. I do this, I do that. You should use me. It was, Hey, I'm just gonna show you exactly what I do. I'm going to show you the good times, the bad times. I'm going to tell you when I'm going out with my family and you have this ability to do it directly on your phone for free, for free. So my elevator pitch, my elevator pitch, because that was a long elevator pitch. My elevator pitch would be, everything that you're doing might be working well, but if you can use three more portions of the brain and get your marketing message into their subconscious, what gets them to take action? Would you do it?

Jonathan: 31:28 Most people would say, yes. I say, you can do that through social media. Social media. Yeah, so that's my elevator pitch and that's hopefully a good answer for you. That was a great answer. I'm going to use that and show people this video when they sat. I don't want to do it. I'll be like, just give it 30 seconds and [inaudible] and it's, that makes sense. The great thing about it is a lot of people are hesitant to use it, not because they don't think that it can get them business. Most people believe if I do these things, I'll get more business. However, they're so captivated in the wrong things. Well, I only have a thousand followers, so it's not going to be good. Well, they only got 50 likes, you know, so maybe I should buy some likes while I only am doing this. You know, I need to be this expert.

Jonathan: 32:09 I need to have done this 10 years ago when they realized that a million followers does not mean a million clients. If it worked like that, everybody would be on social. But that's not the case. So you're focusing on the wrong things. You're focusing on what can social media do for me? What can social media, you know, increase my ego boost because I got a million likes. What you should be focusing on is we do something really well at our business. We want more people to hear about this. You can do that through social. So I think you've got to think about it differently. Stop asking the question, what can social do for me? As much as it, if you have a great program out there, great more people need to hear about it. The only way, the only way they're gonna hear about it is if you tell them that out there. Um, so that's kind of the reason why we believe those things. Oh, I like that answer. And you're right. I think it is a lonely road, uh, because when I started my Instagram, it was random and my best friend's like, dude, just send me a picture tax. I'm like, what do you mean? He goes, why are you posting? And I'm your only follower.

Jonathan: 33:06 I was like anti my personality, you know? So anyways, [inaudible] we have a live audience. So, um, but it was a lonely road. And then you see people engaging in, to your point, the programs, rates, whatever it is in my craft changed somebody's life, lifelong experience. It becomes, uh, an, uh, an addiction to the fulfillment of putting a story out there and changing people's lives. Sweet. We talked about work life integration in the beginning, and I'm going to cut this off because my, uh, life is now coming into play because my son has to get a haircut for picture day. But before we cut it off, what would be one last piece of advice that you would give if nobody listened to this entire episode? They're here for 30 seconds, right at the very end. A piece of advice about something that you did that you would've done differently.

Jonathan: 34:05 If you listen to this, don't take people in your life for granted because you're so focused on what you're building a and be humble. Treat people right. Um, don't get indoctrinated thinking that you got to cut off all your friends, all your family, and change your circle. You can change their perspective, but everybody has a place in your life and it doesn't always have to be the most successful, the most rich. So cherish valuable relationships that you cannot buy with money or fame. So be careful. Hey everybody, this is Jonathan Hawkins. Thank you so much for staying until the very end of this podcast. I definitely appreciate it. As always, make sure to reach out to me via social media at Jonathan Hawkins official. Send me a comment, shoot me a DM. If you have any questions, you can also comment below. Thank you so much. Don't forget to subscribe below and remember who you hire truly matters.